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First ever owner

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Alpine Daimler
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First ever owner

Post by Alpine Daimler »

Hello everyone

As at the present time my workshop a few miles away is not available to me. I keep meaning to get into my cellar and get going overhauling my SU carbs to finally finish off my top end overhaul project but the continual sunny weather makes me want to stay up above ground, listen to the birds, watch the garden come into life and chat with neighbours, all things I consider important and enjoy at the mo.

For change and to distract me just occasionally from unsettling news reports and to avoid the SU's for now I have been investigating a little more about the first ever owner of my LHD manual /overdrive 2.5 saloon.

I received with my Daimler with a Jaguar Heritage Trust Certificate stating that my (big bumper full wood interior) saloon was dispatched on the on the 27th February 1967 about a month after manufacture to Geneva to the rather odd sounding dealer by the name of "Garage Place Claparede" there in that pleasant lakeside city known amongst other things for the 60's TV series The Champions" about Nemesis, an international intelligence organisation based in Geneva.

We often read about typical Daimler owners being landed gentry and/or doctors, bank managers, lawyers, academics and the like, my first owner more that fits the bill. I have discovered quite a story that makes me even more proud of my Daimler and to perform all the jobs that much better, quick, read on......

The first registered owner of 1A 20561 DN in opalescent dark green with suede green interior, one wing mirror, no "D" emblem on the bonnet inexplicably and, strangely, no fitted in the grills fog lights was a Pierre Dorolle. A quick google of this name and city for the time comes up with a Pierre-Marie Dorolle, the deputy directer general of the World Health Organisation from 1950 to 1973, one doesn't get to stay in a job like that for so long if one is not any good and, from what I have read, he was more than just plain good. It must have been him, please!

Pierre-Marie Dorolle was born on the 14th November 1899 at Wassy, Haute Marne, France, the son of Maurice Leopold Dorolle, a professor of logic and philosophy, and his wife Marie Luce, daughter of Elphége Lefèvre, a barrister, some may argue the perfect pedigree for a future Daimler owner.

Following the end of WW1 where he served as health worker he went on to study medicine. After qualifying he joined the French Marines. He was sent to French Indo-China and served there as specialist in public health and administrator until 1950. During these 26 years of his colonial service Pierre Dorolle held a number of important posts. He was director of health services of the city of Hanoï, chief medical officer of the Saigon-Cholon area, lecturer at the Faculty of Medicine of Saigon, director of health of Annam, and then director of public health at the French High Commission. In the last mentioned capacity, Dorolle took part, after the second world war, in the negotiations for the transfer of power between France, Viet Nam, Cambodia and Laos.

To say he went on to have a "glittering" career in international medicine and diplomacy is thoroughly inadequate, here yet another passage of his obituary from the Royal College of Physicians :

..........But Pierre was not just a skilful international bureaucrat: he felt deeply the importance of international health work, he could give an address of commanding erudition at any function in the French or English speaking worlds, using a text of his own devising and not merely a speech drafted for him. He was trusted implicitly by delegates and experts of every nation at WHO. No one doubted his impartiality or integrity. His field experience was mainly in less developed countries, but he was no less at home with the technical experts.

The WHO family of nations has every reason to be grateful to this physically slight and unassuming man for his long service at the highest level. A World Health Organization that is universally accepted and admired is a monument to Pierre Dorolle as much as to anyone, and it was his special virtue that he did not know that. Most men are less modest’.

Dorolle’s last public function was at the commemoration in Marseilles on 3rd October 1980 of the 75th anniversary of the Institute of Tropical Medicine of the French Armed Services, where Pierre Dorolle — a former student — was one of the honoured guests.

A great specialist of tropical public health, a brilliant international civil servant, a generous host, a faithful friend, a refined and distinguished Frenchman with an admiration for British culture, Pierre Dorolle’s memory will be cherished by all who had the privilege of knowing him.

"with an admiration for British culture" ......no wonder he chose a Daimler, he died on the 13th of November 1980, a day before what would have been his 81st birthday.

Dr Dorolle is an example of some of the dedicated, courageous, and exacting individuals who found- ed and developed WHO. Many former WHO staff remember him with fondness and abiding respect.

Keep well all.

Rob C

PS This isn't me, it's 'im!!
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grahamemmett
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Re: First ever owner

Post by grahamemmett »

Wonderful story
Graham Emmett ¦ DLOC Chairman ¦ chair@dloc.co.uk ¦ 07967 109160
Northwich, Cheshire
DB18 1949 LCV522 (Yes that one with the P100s)

Brian-H
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Re: First ever owner

Post by Brian-H »

Uplifting indeed :)

ranald
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Re: First ever owner

Post by ranald »

Brilliant. I love these stories. You must let Kevin Bennett have it for publication in the DM. I too researched the first owner of my car, taking me right back to his birth year of 1869! All the best and take care, Ranald

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Alpine Daimler
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Re: First ever owner

Post by Alpine Daimler »

ranald wrote: Sat Mar 28, 2020 8:20 am Brilliant. I love these stories. You must let Kevin Bennett have it for publication in the DM. I too researched the first owner of my car, taking me right back to his birth year of 1869! All the best and take care, Ranald
Hello Ranald

I have passed it on to Keven at DM for his consideration as to whether it may be of interest to readers of our club mag and perhaps inspire others to do likewise. First registered owners don't have to have glittering careers, its just plain interesting to know what kind of folk bought our cars when they were brand new whether they were known for their fame or indeed infamy!

With regard to your own research what a great piece of detective work, you may like to share the results of your research here, I would be most interested to hear of your first owner, we're not doing anything else at the moment.

Best wishes and above all good health from a lovely early spring Munich

Rob C.

Christopher Storey
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Re: First ever owner

Post by Christopher Storey »

Rob : what a great piece of detective work, with a fascinating result. Incidentally, your car is even rarer than mine ; 1A13111DN which is one of the last few rhd broad bumpered manual cars

ranald
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Re: First ever owner

Post by ranald »

In response to Rob's encouragement, here is something about my car's first owner. All my own research. The car came to me in 2011 with very little known history.

Firstly, a photograph....
Major PAyne.JPG
Lanchester 15/18.Reg: LJ6942. First Registered 19th January 1933

My car’s first owner was Major Percy Marriott Payne. TD, FSI, AMInstCE. It was in his ownership until his death on 5th Oct 1949 age 80 at Aylmerton Hall, Aylmerton, Norfolk.

Percy was born on 7th July 1869 in Hammersmith, London although it seems his family later moved to Nottingham. His father William was living in Newcastle Drive, The Park, Nottingham (SW) at the time of the 1911 census. William was born in St Helier, Channel Islands and was a retired rating surveyor. William, died aged 70 on 9th May of the same year.

Percy entered the Midland Railway Company, aged 20, in 1889 as an Assistant on the staff of the Southern Divisional Engineer. He first became a resident engineer on various schemes of new and widening lines before being appointed assistant to the Rating Surveyor in 1900. He became the Chief Rating surveyor in 1906. When the Midland Railway Company was merged into the London Midland and Scottish Railway (LMS) in 1923, Percy was appointed Chief Rating Surveyor for the newly formed company. LMS was then the world's largest transport organisation, it was also the largest commercial enterprise in the British Empire and the United Kingdom's second largest employer, after the Post Office.

When he retired in 1930, his salary was £3,000pa.

First World War. He was made Honorary Major in the Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire Regiment (Territorial Force Reserve), commanding 2 / 7th (Robin Hood) Battalion Sherwood Foresters. He served from 14/09/1914 to 21/02/1916.

His first marriage was in 1895 to Maude Madeline Fletcher. They had 3 children, one of whom was to become a Colonel in the British Army. Maude died in 1929 and Percy remarried Constance Jackson in the following year. They had a son together in 1933.

Constance used the Lanchester for a weekly shopping trip from Aylmerton Hall, Near Cromer to Yarmouth every Friday for shopping.

That's all from me. Now, I pass the challenge to someone else to write about their car's first owner!

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Re: First ever owner

Post by h.j.thomassen »

Until the mid-eighties, the Jaguar sales were handwritten in large sales ledgers. This includes the Daimler sales after the takeover by Jaguar. A picture is here: https://www.jaguarheritage.com/archive- ... tificates/. A page is approx 50cm wide and covers 20 cars. A few decades ago, Anders Clausager (then JDHT archivist, now retired) started a project to convert these into computer files, and I was one of the volunteers to embark on that job. Illegible handwriting by many different people, faltering ballpoints, many self-invented abbreviations, damaged pages etc. etc. made optical (automated) character reading an illusion, so it had to be done as handwork, typing line by line. Clausager's reason behind the project was to be able to deliver the Heritage Certificates from the computer files, and thus significantly decrease the handling on the actual books. Some of those books are literally falling apart already.
Details like date of production, chassis number, engine number, gearbox number and colours of body and interior etc are recorded meticulously (colours by name, not paint codes). Garage (distributor) of sale is often recorded, first owner and initial license plate is recorded sometimes. So if your Heritage Certificate lists a first owner you have had a lucky shot. However, a few years ago the Trustees of the JDHT decided that, because of the ever tightening privacy laws, the name of the first owner is not mentioned on the certificate anymore, even if that name is present in the book.

Hendrik-Jan

p.s. Many books have been converted, but as far as I know the conversion project is still going on. I used to go there one week per year, and have done so for 10 years, first at Browns Lane, later in Gaydon. Unfortunately, due to personal circumstances I had to stop my participation a few years ago. The rules are strict: books must stay on the premises at all times, no copies or photos allowed, and all expenses are on your own. Furthermore, the JDHT archivists have extremely limited office space so the presence of volunteers is "rationed". The good thing is that you have free entry to the Gaydon Museum.
Last edited by h.j.thomassen on Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:48 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Alpine Daimler
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Re: First ever owner

Post by Alpine Daimler »

Ranald, that is a terrific piece of investigative non family genealogy, if there is such a concept! Thanks for telling us the story.

It really doers bring the early history of your Lanchester back to life.

You must be delighted that your first owner enjoyed the privilege of being christened Percy and not something like Wayne, which whilst today is quite OK I suppose it would have been perhaps a little disappointing to learn that.

Its good to read Major Percy also attained suitable academic qualifications, status and dabbled in matters military, as an ex Swindon Railway Works apprentice I was interested to read of his railway career.

And if all the above is not enough he also lived in a Hall, if he lived today I doubt he would "do" internet or Whatsapp!

@ Hendrik-Jan, many thanks for the info. Thanks also to you and/or your colleagues if you transferred all the details of my Daimler with the first owner details to the heritage certificate. What a pity that is no longer performed, I can't believe it would offend anybody or invade their privacy if such details were maintained on the certs today after so many years.

Look after yourselves everyone

Regards
Rob C.

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Re: First ever owner

Post by h.j.thomassen »

Hello Rob,
Just for clarity sake: the work of the volunteers was/is to transfer the information from the handwritten sales ledgers to computer files. Preparing the certificates is always done by a JDHT staff member, and at that moment she/he decides which information will be put on the certificate, with the computer files as the source of the information used.

Hendrik-Jan

p.s. My own impression (which may be incorrect) was that the main reason that the sales were recorded in the ledgers was to keep the Government happy with a total overview of how many cars were built, to keep a record of the key numbers in case the customer ordered replacement keys, and also to keep a hold on warranty claims submitted by the owner after the sale. For the last reason, most entries contained both a date of production, and a date of the delivery to the customer. All these reasons are limited to a few years after the car was manufactured, and the person of the handwriting used was probably still around. But again: this is my personal impression, not supported by "official" evidence. If "recording historical facts for eternity" had been the reason for the existence of the ledgers, the management certainly should have put more effort in better handwriting, better pens/pencils, standardized terminology and, futile as it seems, more writing space per car. E.g. the DS420 limousine (which was my project) often had two colours on the body, and the upholstery often had different colours in front and rear as well. Apart from that, the upholstery material was recorded (leather, West of England cloth, vinyl) and all that had to fit together on a few square centimeters. My magnifying glass was a much-used companion during my project. Also, a better education of the clerks would have helped. Especially for international sales, the variety in misspelled city names and country names is remarkable. The job of an archivist is not always simple.....

p.s.2. The fact that the numbers of the keys are in the ledgers is a major reason why access to them is restricted. At least that is what they told to me. Until a few years ago, the website of the JDHT not only offered the Heritage Certificates as a service to the car owners, but also the supply of replacement keys. I don't know why that service seems to have disappeared (maybe because it is quite difficult to avoid fraud with this service?)

p.s..3 The pre-Jaguar Daimler sales were recorded, also hand written, in much smaller notebooks, the size of which is comparable to the notebooks used in schools. Within the JDHT those are known as "the Daimler blue books" because of the colour of their hard covers. They contain much less information per car than the Jaguar ledgers do.

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