I have made this same comment many times in many forums. Thus far no one has been able to explain to me how the motoring world didn't collapse with cars' fuel systems breaking down through the use of Cleveland fuels (which in fact contained up to 28% ethanol depending on season), yet just 10% is expected to be so catastrophic.Christopher Storey wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 7:27 am I believe that the hysteria about ethanol ( more properly called ethyl alcohol ) based fuels is just that . For the first 250,000 miles of my motoring career , from about 1962 to 1973, my preferred fuel was Cleveland Discol which at one stage was a blend of 75:25 petrol to alcohol. I never suffered any fuel system problem in a number of cars, some of which were pre-war
Please visit the Club's website https://www.dloc.org.uk/ to join. Visit https://www.dloc.org.uk/adhoc to DONATE towards the cost of the forum.
Please don't post someone's email address to avoid it being harvested by spambots and it's against GDPR regulations.
Always look at "ACTIVE TOPICS" to see all posts in date & time order as they are sometimes moved; or look at "Your Posts".
Please add Reg. nrs. when posting a photo or anything about a car as this will help searches. Don't add punctuation next to nr. as this negates search.
CHANGED YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS since registering?, click your username and check your address in User Control Panel, Profile, Account Settings.
If you want help to register, use "contact us" at page bottom for help.
Please don't post someone's email address to avoid it being harvested by spambots and it's against GDPR regulations.
Always look at "ACTIVE TOPICS" to see all posts in date & time order as they are sometimes moved; or look at "Your Posts".
Please add Reg. nrs. when posting a photo or anything about a car as this will help searches. Don't add punctuation next to nr. as this negates search.
CHANGED YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS since registering?, click your username and check your address in User Control Panel, Profile, Account Settings.
If you want help to register, use "contact us" at page bottom for help.
E10 fuel and other matters
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
- captain bobo
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:32 pm
- Location: Kimbolton, Cambs
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
The FBHV article was very interesting.
There may well be a lot of hysteria as is suggested, but I think there is sufficient evidence that there are some modifications or actions we can take that would be sensible to combat the issues that E10 petrol can cause in our older vehicles.
I've just been looking at various additives that claim to protect engine and fuel system components from ethanol. There is a somewhat bewildering array of octane boosters, fuel stabilisers, lead replacement additives and " anti ethanol" additives, one of them using enzymes.
I'd be interested to hear the views from forum members about their views on additives and which type of additive might offer the best protection.
There may well be a lot of hysteria as is suggested, but I think there is sufficient evidence that there are some modifications or actions we can take that would be sensible to combat the issues that E10 petrol can cause in our older vehicles.
I've just been looking at various additives that claim to protect engine and fuel system components from ethanol. There is a somewhat bewildering array of octane boosters, fuel stabilisers, lead replacement additives and " anti ethanol" additives, one of them using enzymes.
I'd be interested to hear the views from forum members about their views on additives and which type of additive might offer the best protection.
Best wishes, Dave B
-
- Classic Wise Man
- Posts: 1601
- Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:55 am
- Location: Ridgewood - East Sussex
- Contact:
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
Hello Dave,
I covered this topic in a recent DM.
With regard to keeping Ethanol at bay, there are 2 or 3x excellent products:
Flexolite Ethanolmate: https://www.flexolite.co.uk/categories/ ... -additives
Castrol Valve Master: as per the above link
Millers VSPe: https://www.frost.co.uk/millers-vsp-e-p ... HEQAvD_BwE
Of equal importance is ensuring that the fuel pipes in a classic (not just Daimler) are ethanol resistant. For this, one of the best if not the best is Gates Barricade petrol hose. An added benefit is that you can purchase Barricade in Imperial sizes - you need 1/4" and 5/16" for the Daimler V8 Saloon.
Probably the best VFM seller for this is Moss Europe, who supply only genuine hose unlike some eBay sellers.
Regards.
Richard.
I covered this topic in a recent DM.
With regard to keeping Ethanol at bay, there are 2 or 3x excellent products:
Flexolite Ethanolmate: https://www.flexolite.co.uk/categories/ ... -additives
Castrol Valve Master: as per the above link
Millers VSPe: https://www.frost.co.uk/millers-vsp-e-p ... HEQAvD_BwE
Of equal importance is ensuring that the fuel pipes in a classic (not just Daimler) are ethanol resistant. For this, one of the best if not the best is Gates Barricade petrol hose. An added benefit is that you can purchase Barricade in Imperial sizes - you need 1/4" and 5/16" for the Daimler V8 Saloon.
Probably the best VFM seller for this is Moss Europe, who supply only genuine hose unlike some eBay sellers.
Regards.
Richard.
1968 Daimler V8-250 Saloon
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024
- captain bobo
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:32 pm
- Location: Kimbolton, Cambs
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
Thank you Richard, very helpful. I missed the article in DM unfortunately.
Best wishes, Dave B
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
I fully agree I seem to remember that my fathers 1950 lowlight 918cc sidevalve Morris Minor went perceptibly better on Cleveland Discol. AFAIK the brand name was related to ICI who refined this fuel from mainly otherwise waste products at their Cleveland complex.Chris_R wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 5:50 pmI have made this same comment many times in many forums. Thus far no one has been able to explain to me how the motoring world didn't collapse with cars' fuel systems breaking down through the use of Cleveland fuels (which in fact contained up to 28% ethanol depending on season), yet just 10% is expected to be so catastrophic.Christopher Storey wrote: ↑Wed May 26, 2021 7:27 am I believe that the hysteria about ethanol ( more properly called ethyl alcohol ) based fuels is just that . For the first 250,000 miles of my motoring career , from about 1962 to 1973, my preferred fuel was Cleveland Discol which at one stage was a blend of 75:25 petrol to alcohol. I never suffered any fuel system problem in a number of cars, some of which were pre-war
However it is my impression that many older classics had metal (copper?) fuel lines from tank and pump to carburettor and will not therefore be affected by E10 other than tuning issues.
On another aspect of this discussion why are we obliged to have E10? Afaik this is an EU directive. We aren't a member?
-
- Classic Wise Man
- Posts: 1601
- Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:55 am
- Location: Ridgewood - East Sussex
- Contact:
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
E10 has absolutely nothing to do with the EU.
The UK is part of the United Nations and it is the UN that is pressing for changes under their Climate Control Directive.
E10 reduces the amount of harmful emissions - hence E10 being on UK soil as it will be in many developed countries.
The goal is to reach Net Zero (Carbon emissions) by 2050 and this is to be achieved by mass reduction if not 99.9% of climate damaging CO2 emissions; where Carbon is the main identified culprit.
Regards.
Richard.
The UK is part of the United Nations and it is the UN that is pressing for changes under their Climate Control Directive.
E10 reduces the amount of harmful emissions - hence E10 being on UK soil as it will be in many developed countries.
The goal is to reach Net Zero (Carbon emissions) by 2050 and this is to be achieved by mass reduction if not 99.9% of climate damaging CO2 emissions; where Carbon is the main identified culprit.
Regards.
Richard.
1968 Daimler V8-250 Saloon
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024
- watkindj
- Extremely Wise Man
- Posts: 1156
- Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:27 am
- Location: Cambridge
- Contact:
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
https://www.frost.co.uk/ethomix-corrosi ... rotection/
Another product from Frost to protect against the new E10 fuel
Another product from Frost to protect against the new E10 fuel
Darren
South Cambridgeshire
XJ Registrar &
LD10 Registrar
LD10 Website Webmaster Incorporating (Worldwide Lanchester LD10 Register)
http://ld10.awardspace.co.uk
South Cambridgeshire
XJ Registrar &
LD10 Registrar
LD10 Website Webmaster Incorporating (Worldwide Lanchester LD10 Register)
http://ld10.awardspace.co.uk
- captain bobo
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:32 pm
- Location: Kimbolton, Cambs
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
I ordered a bottle of Flexolite Ethanolmate which arrived yesterday. Reading the label, I noticed that they claim to boost the octane as well, so for a moment I wondered if it would help my old Saab 2.3 litre turbo which doesn't like current 2** petrol much. But then I noticed written in large letters "do not use in vehicles with catalytic converters".
Can anyone enlighten me as to why?
Can anyone enlighten me as to why?
Best wishes, Dave B
Re: E10 fuel and other matters
One possibility that I can think of is contamination of the lambda sensors, causing the engine to run either too rich or too lean - I think either condition can then slowly damage the cat