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E10 fuel and other matters

Technical issues not related to a DLOC car marque, eg tyres, ethanol, other car makes, etc. and legal, political and insurance
Chris_R
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by Chris_R »

Christopher Storey wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 7:27 am I believe that the hysteria about ethanol ( more properly called ethyl alcohol ) based fuels is just that . For the first 250,000 miles of my motoring career , from about 1962 to 1973, my preferred fuel was Cleveland Discol which at one stage was a blend of 75:25 petrol to alcohol. I never suffered any fuel system problem in a number of cars, some of which were pre-war
I have made this same comment many times in many forums. Thus far no one has been able to explain to me how the motoring world didn't collapse with cars' fuel systems breaking down through the use of Cleveland fuels (which in fact contained up to 28% ethanol depending on season), yet just 10% is expected to be so catastrophic.

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captain bobo
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by captain bobo »

The FBHV article was very interesting.

There may well be a lot of hysteria as is suggested, but I think there is sufficient evidence that there are some modifications or actions we can take that would be sensible to combat the issues that E10 petrol can cause in our older vehicles.

I've just been looking at various additives that claim to protect engine and fuel system components from ethanol. There is a somewhat bewildering array of octane boosters, fuel stabilisers, lead replacement additives and " anti ethanol" additives, one of them using enzymes.

I'd be interested to hear the views from forum members about their views on additives and which type of additive might offer the best protection.
Best wishes, Dave B

classiclife
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by classiclife »

Hello Dave,

I covered this topic in a recent DM.

With regard to keeping Ethanol at bay, there are 2 or 3x excellent products:

Flexolite Ethanolmate: https://www.flexolite.co.uk/categories/ ... -additives

Castrol Valve Master: as per the above link

Millers VSPe: https://www.frost.co.uk/millers-vsp-e-p ... HEQAvD_BwE

Of equal importance is ensuring that the fuel pipes in a classic (not just Daimler) are ethanol resistant. For this, one of the best if not the best is Gates Barricade petrol hose. An added benefit is that you can purchase Barricade in Imperial sizes - you need 1/4" and 5/16" for the Daimler V8 Saloon.
Probably the best VFM seller for this is Moss Europe, who supply only genuine hose unlike some eBay sellers.

Regards.

Richard.
1968 Daimler V8-250 Saloon
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024

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captain bobo
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by captain bobo »

Thank you Richard, very helpful. I missed the article in DM unfortunately.
Best wishes, Dave B

KV8
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by KV8 »

Chris_R wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 5:50 pm
Christopher Storey wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 7:27 am I believe that the hysteria about ethanol ( more properly called ethyl alcohol ) based fuels is just that . For the first 250,000 miles of my motoring career , from about 1962 to 1973, my preferred fuel was Cleveland Discol which at one stage was a blend of 75:25 petrol to alcohol. I never suffered any fuel system problem in a number of cars, some of which were pre-war
I have made this same comment many times in many forums. Thus far no one has been able to explain to me how the motoring world didn't collapse with cars' fuel systems breaking down through the use of Cleveland fuels (which in fact contained up to 28% ethanol depending on season), yet just 10% is expected to be so catastrophic.
I fully agree I seem to remember that my fathers 1950 lowlight 918cc sidevalve Morris Minor went perceptibly better on Cleveland Discol. AFAIK the brand name was related to ICI who refined this fuel from mainly otherwise waste products at their Cleveland complex.

However it is my impression that many older classics had metal (copper?) fuel lines from tank and pump to carburettor and will not therefore be affected by E10 other than tuning issues.

On another aspect of this discussion why are we obliged to have E10? Afaik this is an EU directive. We aren't a member?

classiclife
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by classiclife »

E10 has absolutely nothing to do with the EU.

The UK is part of the United Nations and it is the UN that is pressing for changes under their Climate Control Directive.

E10 reduces the amount of harmful emissions - hence E10 being on UK soil as it will be in many developed countries.

The goal is to reach Net Zero (Carbon emissions) by 2050 and this is to be achieved by mass reduction if not 99.9% of climate damaging CO2 emissions; where Carbon is the main identified culprit.

Regards.

Richard.
1968 Daimler V8-250 Saloon
DLOC East Sussex Branch Secretary
DLOC 2.5L V8 & V8-250 Registrar - https://www.dloc.org.uk/v8-250
DLOC 2024 International Rally - https://www.dloc.org.uk/rally-2024

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watkindj
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by watkindj »

https://www.frost.co.uk/ethomix-corrosi ... rotection/

Another product from Frost to protect against the new E10 fuel
Darren
South Cambridgeshire
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LD10 Website Webmaster Incorporating (Worldwide Lanchester LD10 Register)
http://ld10.awardspace.co.uk

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captain bobo
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by captain bobo »

I ordered a bottle of Flexolite Ethanolmate which arrived yesterday. Reading the label, I noticed that they claim to boost the octane as well, so for a moment I wondered if it would help my old Saab 2.3 litre turbo which doesn't like current 2** petrol much. But then I noticed written in large letters "do not use in vehicles with catalytic converters".

Can anyone enlighten me as to why?
Best wishes, Dave B

Brian-H
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Re: E10 fuel and other matters

Post by Brian-H »

One possibility that I can think of is contamination of the lambda sensors, causing the engine to run either too rich or too lean - I think either condition can then slowly damage the cat

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