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Stuck cylinder head

Technical issues not related to a DLOC car marque, eg tyres, ethanol, other car makes, etc. and legal, political and insurance
davidian
Posts: 99
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2019 11:32 am
Location: la vinuela spain

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by davidian »

This post has raised a lot of response so I will add my two pennyworth, could you not use two locking nuts and unscrew the studs from the block then knock off the head sideways.
David Ian.

Stan Thomas
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Location: Penkridge. Staffs.

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by Stan Thomas »

A sound idea Davidian, but I suspect there is not sufficient thread protruding through the head to wholly accommodate two nuts, notwithstanding the stud might be sufficently corroded not to give way -with the possibility of damaging the thread which is sacrocant to achieving the correct torque when tightened.

Worth a "half-hearted" try though - provided not too much force is used, and only if some of the studs screw out, its a start.

However there remains the "electric" method which was very widely used way back when I worked on the shop floor, but it really should not be contemplated without experienced guidance. So see how you get on Mike and let me know how you fair, and if need be, I'll talk you through how to go about it by a P.M. or on the 'phone.

davidian
Posts: 99
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2019 11:32 am
Location: la vinuela spain

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by davidian »

Electric Method ¡ I am intrigued .I thought they abolished the electric chair years ago. sounds a bit dangerous .
David Ian

mikemillen
Posts: 307
Joined: Mon May 03, 2021 8:34 am
Location: Bognor Regis

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by mikemillen »

I've just returned from 3 days at the Goodwood Revival, so unfortunately I haven't been near the Lanchester since last weekend, and it will be another week before I do. The tiresome rigmarole of working for a living keeps me from such important matters as my engine during the week, I'm afraid.

I'm moderately confident of the nylon rope trick doing the business, but failing that, unscrewing the studs may well be an option... 3 of them unscrewed themselves as I was removing the nuts anyway, so perhaps the rest aren't too tight.

I'm also intrigued about the "electric method"... it conjures up a number of mildy scary procedures. :-)

Brian-H
Very Wise Man
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Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by Brian-H »

Decades ago I also used an electric method - on the floor in my father's garage.
This youtube video from 2012 shows the method :geek:
Note that this method causes hydrogen and oxygen gas to be produced 8-)
If anyone wants to know more, email or call me on help@123.456.789 ;)

Stan Thomas
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Location: Penkridge. Staffs.

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by Stan Thomas »

The method described in the previous post video is not applicable to removing cylinder head studs as in Davidian's case.

However, as I posted earlier, if Davidian wishes to P.M's me, I'll gladly talk him though how to Anne Boylen his Lanchester.

John Hitchins
Site Admin
Posts: 244
Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:52 am
Location: Wellington Somerset

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by John Hitchins »

My DB18 had this problem. The studs had expanded with rust. Nothing would shift the head. All because of a seized valve. In the end I had to drill each stud burning many drills out. After drilling halfway down the head moved a fraction and was gently prised off.
The studs are still seized in the block as abandoned for the time being due to being unwell.

Brian-H
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Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by Brian-H »

John Hitchins wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:05 am My DB18 had this problem. The studs had expanded with rust. Nothing would shift the head. All because of a seized valve. In the end I had to drill each stud burning many drills out. After drilling halfway down the head moved a fraction and was gently prised off.
The studs are still seized in the block as abandoned for the time being due to being unwell.
Not wishing to sound patronising to anyone in any way at all, but, this is absolutely the sort of contribution that a forum does need.
Forums are for openly sharing ideas, whether relevant or not relevant, or good techniques or bad techniques.

On a TR forum https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/in ... nder-head/ - weld the nuts onto the tops of the studs (and then obviously replace the studs). If a stud snaps (happened to me in the 70s), rather then use an extractor, my father knew an expert technician and he came round to the house to remove the remnant - he removed that remnant by using a centre punch and a hammer, I didn't see him do it, but I understand he did it by using the centre punch almost sideways.

Note that in that same TR thread, the OP eventually cut a nut in half (he didn't say "sideways" but that's what he meant), and then locked the two halves together to undo the studs. Not sure if it was one of the original nuts, or possibly a slightly "longer" nut of the required thread from elsewhere. You could also grind two of the nuts a bit "shorter" and use those.

It might also be possible to use the electrolysis method by pouring the mixture (see video) down/round a stud, and then connect the battery charger to the stud, and to a very small steel pin in the mixture (making sure the pin doesn't touch the stud or the head, by wrapping insulating tape round the pin just leaving the tip of the pin in the mixture). That ought to remove all the rust on the stud, do each stud one at a time of course.

EDIT - here is another idea for removal of the head. He doesn't state how old the engine is, but as it's out of an Alfa Duetto 1600, the engine could be maybe 50 years old. The engine is a 4 cyl DOHC with spark plugs down the middle, he removes both cams, and then uses modified spark plugs with long studs in the modified plugs, to force the head up against the top of the block/head studs - see video . You can only lift the head until it's flush with the top of the block/head studs, but he then inserts plates to force the head all the way up (see video).

On the Daimler and Lanchester OHV engines, the second phase is clearly not viable, but the first phase may work by placing a steel plate vertically along the block/head studs (one plate each side) then use a main plate in the same way as the video (welded to the side plates) i.e. something resembling a strong, slightly narrower, rocker cover. Then, instead of the modified spark plugs used in the video, use the rocker cover threads in the head, for the "lifting" studs to screw into. When the head is up by a cm, you could then cut the block/head studs away.

mikemillen
Posts: 307
Joined: Mon May 03, 2021 8:34 am
Location: Bognor Regis

Re: Stuck cylinder head

Post by mikemillen »

I'm pleased to report that the Rope Trick was entirely successful... the head popped up with the first turn of the starting handle.

I'm also pleased to see that at first glance, everything looks very clean and healthy inside.
Next job is to assess wear on the cylinders and guides.
I'll start another topic for that.

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