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EL24 cylinderhead

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Keith Ashworth
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by Keith Ashworth »

FWIW I've been involved with Daimlers and the DLOC around 40 years, and see the board's decision as the correct one. Much as I think club's should be involved with the assistance of obtaining spare parts, the many different cars that were produced by Daimler and Lanchester makes it totally unviable. We have a chap here in Australia that has made a new crown wheel for his Special Sports as there are none to be found and I recently purchased a lot of LD10 parts for my restoration only to use perhaps 5% of them, and the rest are now taking up room.
Years ago the similar discussion was about the spares at Gamilingay.
Truth was that most of them were of little value as they pertained to cars that were small in number and the club could not justify the large expense of keeping them and running the spares operation.
The future of the club lies in attracting new members, so the shows such as the NEC are of great importance and the magazine ,which is for many members the only contact with the club, is superb and the quality must be maintained if the club is to expect members to pay the subscriptions.
I do get upset to read people won't renew their subscriptions because of decisions made , that are not as clear cut as may be thought , and the board has to consider all membership in reaching them.
Keith

Salmons
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by Salmons »

I also have been involved with Daimlers for around 40 years being a DLOC member since 1972, apart from a short break, when I owned an SP250 and was enticed away.

I have read all the various contributions about Cylinder heads for the EL24. I understand what Keith is saying but I do feel that in this instance DLOC could have offered some contribution towards the manufacture of these heads.

I was also surprised that so few owners of this model came forward to show support to Claudio and his friend.

After all without a cylinder head their cars are only going to be worth spares value.

Dennis

Sydsmith
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by Sydsmith »

I don't have an EL24 and could not afford to own one and keep it properly, but as I see it the cars are special and a good one a thing of value all be it very under valued by the market.

I was very sorry to see Big Col using the ultimate threat. Using the threat to resign is in my view very self defeating. I have often disagreed with executive or majority decisions in the organisations I have belonged to, but I always stayed the course and fought for what I thought was right on the principle that had I resigned, I would loose all chance of making a worth while contribution.

The EL24 head project is viable only if there is a market for the product. So far those who own the cars have kept a low profile and have been reluctant to come forward with orders. I guess because they have been concerned about cost and have been holding fire waiting for the cost bomb shell to drop. That makes it very difficult for the project managers, but like all things there is a price and the price will always be high if the product is complex and the market is small. How much more complex could a project be? £6000 should not be a surprise.

We do not have enough information to question the boards decision and can only rely on their judgement, we appointed them.

JT7196
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by JT7196 »

I would like to express my extreme disappointment at the Boards decision Not to support this very worthwhile venture.
We do really need people like Claudio,John, and of course Marcel, and what a fine job they do ! I really do hope that the Boards decision will not lead to other members leaving the DLOC , but, there must be many more members who like myself feel that the Club could have at least made a “Token” gesture towards the cost of remanufacturing those Cylinder Heads .
I to have made a small contribution by having Wheel Nuts re-manufactured for the models under my duristriction as your “LA” Registrar,, so am able to understand the difficulty in making the desision as to whether a “Project” is going to be viable or not.
I was fortunate to have been able to extract quite a lot of support, although unlike Claudio and John ,I had orders and payment before actually having them produced, so my financial “risk” was only nominal.
As an aside, if anybody else needs some, I can always have some more produced, not only for the “LA” range but also for E18’s & E20’s

Best wishes A’l :)

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marchesmark
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by marchesmark »

This is very disappointing, and for me as EL24 Registrar I regard it as a bit of a personal kick in the teeth. Some points I would like to make:

- that there is another person working on replacement heads does not 'dilute' this project in the slightest. In fact it simply gives the Board options for financial support. In the event the Club has decided not to support either effort.
- large numbers of cars in small volumes does not mean spares are unviable - ask the Armstrong Siddeley Owners Club. It just means we don't do it correctly.
- attracting new members is laudable, but not everyone wants to see rows of V8s lined up. Without Club support, the pre-war cars will disappear, as they are already starting to do.

Claudio, you must wish you had bought a Rolls-Royce instead...

ron.rsp
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by ron.rsp »

Having an EL24 under restoration I have taken an interest in this fine project.
The Board have distanced themselves deciding that other things are of more
importance.
The few owners that will benefit are not the issue, the cars are the issue and
EL24s will just drift away into the scrap heap of great British engineering and
they could be lost forever.
A show stand and "payed" professionals are poor value compared to any EL24
running sweet on the road. We are only custodians in our short life and should
be able to pass on our Daimlers in good order for the next generation to enjoy.
Any car clubs aims and objectives should be to foster an interest in their models.
The show stand make look grand but little point to it if any visitor who may
take an interest in our cars is advised not to take on an EL24 as spares are a
problem to source!

Ron, EL24 EXA 771

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John-B
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by John-B »

grahamemmett wrote: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:04 am The club has a huge, and I mean HUGE reserve funded by the members years ago as "The Spares Loan Fund". It was created to purchase the spares from a trader (Ben Mason) to create a Spares business within the DLOC.
This was not successful and the spares and the property were sold off. The resulting cash has remained (depreciating) in the bank since.
So what's the problem with funding projects like this with money that members have freely given for this very purpose?
Come on board STEP UP.
To put this topic into perspective, how big is the fund?

grahamemmett
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by grahamemmett »

How big is the 'fund'?

Well it's hard to determine as a long time ago it ceased to be identified separately but was absorbed into the club's net worth.
As the subscriptions are set so that the club more or less breaks even financially each year, then if you look at the last accounts you'll see the Net Assets which represents the financial reserves the board has at it's disposal.

Naturally the board can't support every project but my initial comments were really saying "What's the policy?" so that people know where they may stand before starting out on an expensive project and their won't be the disappointment felt when requests for support are turned down.
Graham Emmett ¦ DLOC Chairman ¦ chair@dloc.co.uk ¦ 07967 109160
Northwich, Cheshire
DB18 1949 LCV522 (Yes that one with the P100s)

Phillmore
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by Phillmore »

ron.rsp wrote: Wed Nov 01, 2017 5:08 pm Having an EL24 under restoration I have taken an interest in this fine project.
The Board have distanced themselves deciding that other things are of more
importance.
The few owners that will benefit are not the issue, the cars are the issue and
EL24s will just drift away into the scrap heap of great British engineering and
they could be lost forever.
A show stand and "payed" professionals are poor value compared to any EL24
running sweet on the road. We are only custodians in our short life and should
be able to pass on our Daimlers in good order for the next generation to enjoy.
Any car clubs aims and objectives should be to foster an interest in their models.
The show stand make look grand but little point to it if any visitor who may
take an interest in our cars is advised not to take on an EL24 as spares are a
problem to source!

Ron, EL24 EXA 771
I'm not an EL24 owner but echo these comments.
Andy

1954 Conquest Mk1, 1956 Conquest Mk2, 1957 Conquest Century Mk2, 1955 Austin A90 Westminster

Marcel Renshaw
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Re: EL24 cylinderhead

Post by Marcel Renshaw »

It was with regret that the board decided not to offer funding.
Claudio and John were a number of years into the head project before the club considered helping fund projects.
The club aim to help projects but the policy is that a costed proposal needs to be submitted before the work starts.
From my experience knowing the final cost is troublesome. Foundries often need to see the tooling before quoting for components and machine shops need to know order quantities if fixtures need making , cnc programs writing or special tooling ordering.
One of the big considerations the board were faced with, funding a head project could use 6-10% of the members money.
With 2 suppliers for only 6 heads there was little chance of getting the money back.
The board also hadn't got proposals with enough details to ensure that the heads wouldn't fail again.
I'm sure Claudio has done all the modification needed but that doesn't necessarily satisfy a board or 1750 people who are funding it through their membership contributions.
I would love to put many proposals before the board and get members financial assistance to manufacture much needed parts.
From experience making parts mainly for pre war Daimler and Lanchester cars I know that the payback is often 4-5years with some things longer.
Model registrars are often unsure how many cars exist or their condition. This is often because we don't update them.
The setback with the decision regarding EL24 heads won't stop me promoting other projects for members.It just the start of the learning curve for me and the club.
Yes the club needs to promote itself with club stands, improved websites and also a willingness to fund the remanufacture of obsolete parts.
Please stay with the club and steer it in the right direction. Tell your model registrar about your cars and your needs. The more information we have the better.

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